In this episode, Heather Quick, discusses mental illness in marriage. She discusses mental health in US and divorce, how mental illness effects marriage and divorcing a spouse with mental health issues.
"Women Winning Divorce" is a radio show and podcast hosted by Heather Quick, CEO and Owner of Florida Women's Law Group. Each week we focus on different aspects of family law to help guide women through the difficult and emotional legal challenges they are facing. Heather brings over 20 years of law experience that advocates and empowers women to achieve happier and healthier lives. Join Heather each week as she discusses family law issues including divorce, custody, alimony, paternity, narcissism, mediation and more. This program was created to provide tips and insight to women with family law issues. It is not intended to be legal advice because every situation is different. Visit us at https://www.womenwinningdivorce.com/ for more resources. Text us at 904-944-6800 for a copy of Heather's Top 5 Divorce Tips. If you have questions or a topic you would like Heather to cover, email us at marketing@4womenlaw.com
Women Winning Divorce
Episode 41
Mental Illness in a Marriage
Julie Morgan:
Welcome to Women Winning Divorce with your host Heather Quick. Heather brings over 20 years of law experience that advocates and empowers women to achieve happier and healthier lives. Each week we provide knowledge and guidance on different aspects of family law. To help lead women through the difficult and emotional legal challenges that they are facing. Listen in as she discusses issues including divorce, custody, alimony, paternity, narcissism, mediation, and other family law issues. To provide insight on the journey of women winning divorce. Welcome to the show. I'm Julie Morgan, and I'm joined by your host Heather Quick. Hi, Heather. How are you today?
Heather Quick:
I am great, Julie. How are you?
Julie Morgan:
I'm doing very well. Thank you. Today's topic is a good one. It's a serious one, and it's something that definitely needs to be addressed, and its mental illness. This has been such a taboo topic lately. Well, it was before. Now it's not so much. It's almost hard to talk about. How does this affect a divorce? How does it affect a marriage? Where do we begin?
Heather Quick:
That's the best first question, where do we begin? Because it affects so many people. I mean, in 2021, the Mental Health of America Organization, they release a study every year, and in 2021 it shows that 20% of Americans suffer from some mental illness, that's approximately 50 million people in the United States. That's a lot.
Julie Morgan:
That is. So that tells me that this is something that people are dealing with in their marriage. Obviously if they plan to get a divorce, also in their divorce. And this is something, before, like I said, it was taboo, but people are talking about it now.
Heather Quick:
They are. There's more talk about it. Now, I don't know if there's more action being taken because of that talk or not, but what the statistics also show is over half of adults with a mental illness don't receive treatment. And that is very concerning of course.
Julie Morgan:
Here's my thing. I wonder if it's because they don't realize that something is a little bit off.
Heather Quick:
Oh, I think that is probably a big part of it. And sometimes you may feel off, but you don't have the words to describe it or you may not understand, hey, there might be a solution. There might be some way for me to not feel like this. I think that's a big part of it. Is there really something out there that can help me?
Julie Morgan:
Yeah. And because if it's not something that you've heard about or read about, you just don't, like you've said before, you just don't know what you don't know.
Heather Quick:
Exactly. It does depend on I think, your belief system and well, that would be weak for me to go talk to somebody or seek some type of help for a mental illness.
Julie Morgan:
I would have to say that that's definitely been the issue. I'm an African American, and that's definitely been an issue in the African American community, so I can definitely see that.
Heather Quick:
Right. I mean it can be, I think there's so many types with whether it has to do with your ethnicity, your religious background, just your whole growing up, what you believe is okay or not okay. Sometimes it's just like, well suck it up, deal with it. I think that can be a big part of it. Again, like we talked about, not even understanding this is something that there is help for. We all have our point of view on a lot of that, but there are so many avenues, so many areas and different ways to treat different things. Not everything has to have a pill.
Julie Morgan:
And you know what, that's probably or possibly, I'm going to say that, it's possibly a reason that those who do realize that something is just a little bit off, that they do have a mental illness. That's possibly a reason why they say, "You know what, I'm just going to live with it the way it is."
Heather Quick:
Yeah, or they've gone through it and there's a lot, some of the stuff I have when we start to talk about it in divorce and certain issues. I mean, I have a very small amount of understanding. I was a nurse before I went to law school.
Julie Morgan:
Hold on.
Heather Quick:
So of course I studied that, and learned a lot and had some actual experience with individuals in more of a crisis situation because I worked in an emergency room.
Julie Morgan:
Okay. Heather, you made me interject just there for a moment. My apologies, but hold on, wait a minute. That's something new. I didn't know that.
Heather Quick:
Yes, yes. I was a registered nurse and I worked in the trauma ER and the trauma intensive care for a short time.
Julie Morgan:
Okay. So you know what, you know we're going to have to explore this just little bit, but I'm going to get back to law and all of that. But okay. Like I said, this is a serious topic. So based on the statistics that you quoted earlier, what are some of the most common mental health issues that are out there?
Heather Quick:
So what are the most common that the studies and statistics tell us are depression, anxiety, bipolar, and eating disorders.
Julie Morgan:
Okay, wait a minute. I didn't realize that an eating disorder is considered a mental health issue.
Heather Quick:
Yes. It is so based in psychology, and really affects mostly women, not only, but just it's more prevalent that particular one. But starts very early on in psychological development generally and is very, very hard without a lot of help for people to overcome that.
Julie Morgan:
Wow. I didn't realize that. You learn something new every day. Yeah. So when one person has a mental illness in a marriage, at some point it seems become the center, the focus of everything that's going on.
Heather Quick:
Very much so as you can imagine, because you are living with that person. Especially when, I would say, it obviously can play a role in the end of a marriage. Generally it's when things don't change and maybe they can't get better, or won't, or unable. There's so many things, and it doesn't really have to be labeled. It's just that there are issues. I would say it can on both sides, let's say, I'm going to take depression as an example because I think this one is easy to relate to. So you could have a very depressed person and maybe they have tried help, it has been unsuccessful. Okay. At some point that could be a cause and a factor in the dissolving of a marriage. And also if a person has really had depression for any period of time but does get help, treatment is able to emerge from that. They may no longer want to be in the marriage, they might not want to be the one in the marriage any longer once they've found treatment, found a way to stabilize and/or get out of that depression.
Julie Morgan:
It's almost like they may become a different person.
Heather Quick:
Well, it is, and that's what you'll hear from people. I have read that about depression, there are so many things that can factor into that. But just let's say for postpartum depression, which is a real thing and it is clearly has some physiological components to that as well as psychological. But that is so real that it may change. Let's use this for an example because I think anyone can relate to this. If you've ever been sick, okay, well if you're married, you're really thinking, "Hey, my spouse is going to take care of me, right?" And maybe they don't. Then once you're no longer feeling that way, it may change how you feel about that person in that marriage because you were suffering from something, whether it's physical or mental. We're looking for support in that area and not getting it.
So it's not just, people want to divorce their spouse if they have these issues that aren't resolved, it could be the other way around. Maybe they were finally able to get out of it and get control of this and feel better about themselves. And they're like, "where were you during all this?" They may decide, "Now I feel better. I'm out. I don't want to be married to you."
Julie Morgan:
That's interesting. That's interesting. Okay. So we've talked about depression. You just also mentioned postpartum issues as well. What are some of the other mental illnesses that are most associated with divorce?
Heather Quick:
Bipolar disorder and it's just that's, and all of the mental illnesses have, I hate to use the word sad, but it is. With bipolar, because of the medications that are used to treat it and within that psychology of the bipolar it's so... I see people and once they start feeling better, then they stop taking the medication and it really is a rollercoaster, and it can be so very chaotic for a marriage. So bipolar is a very popular one. Addiction, that's also classified as a mental illness. People can disagree or agree with that. I don't really have a comment on that. But PTSD like that, when you look at events that can contribute to somebody then having PTSD, that can really affect a marriage.
We've certainly talked in detail about narcissistic personality disorder. Schizophrenia, schizophrenia is a horrific disease in my experience, which is limited with knowing people with that. Very, very sad as well is paranoia, and then it can get really extreme like borderline personality disorder. And that, if you look at the research and statistics, that's what we see most associated with divorce. But those are the most, that's a lot.
Julie Morgan:
That is a lot. That's just a long list.
Heather Quick:
Indeed it is.
Julie Morgan:
And when you think about this, I think about having an extra person in the relationship.
Heather Quick:
Exactly.
Julie Morgan:
Does that make sense to you? Does that make sense what I'm saying? It's like me, you, and then the other person that you are because of this mental illness.
Heather Quick:
That's right. Or addiction, or whatever. This is the one person, and that I think is one of the most painful things for an individual, a spouse, whose husband or wife is going through these issues. Because you know the person they were when this was either under control or before it took over. It is just really hard to let go of the person that they were or that they are when they are taking their medication, when they are in treatment and counseling. You can see how it's difficult. Those are struggles that people absolutely have in marriages.
Julie Morgan:
And we've also, we've done shows about addiction also shows about narcissistic personality disorder. If you want to listen to those shows, you can go to our website, womenwinningdivorce.com, subscribe, download, and listen, and also tell a friend about it as well. So when we think about these disorders, one thing that came to my mind was what if you met someone and they had one of these mental disorders, and then they got help. But then it's possible that you may not have liked the person that they became.
Heather Quick:
That could be, if you read a lot about bipolar, somebody can be manic for a long time. I'm certain there are varying degrees of that because bipolar is the one, is the really high up side, but then it gets to a very, very low side. Well, let's think if you meet somebody who's just on that energy on the upside and you're unaware that this isn't who they are normally. Then there's a crash, and now they are showing up as a completely different person, that would be a shock.
Julie Morgan:
Absolutely. And then I also, I think about borderline personality disorder that I feel like it used to have a different name possibly.
Heather Quick:
Well, it did. Oh, I think in the media or TV, I think I want to say split personality.
Julie Morgan:
Yes.
Heather Quick:
Right? Is that what sounds right to you? I think that's it. So I'm not 100% sure, but I do think so. I've only seen that in TV shows and movies.
Julie Morgan:
Right. Right. And no, I've never met someone with borderline personality disorder either. But that's another one that you look at it and you say, "Well, this could be multiple people in this relationship," and you could have possibly fallen in love with one of those other people.
Heather Quick:
Yes, absolutely. As different or as rare as that may be, that one clearly makes sense. And how sad for both of the people in that relationship.
Julie Morgan:
Exactly. You're listening to Women Winning Divorce with Heather Quick, Owner and Attorney of Florida Women's Law Group. We're going to take a quick break here and when we return, we're going to talk about how mental illness affects a marriage. We're going to dig even deeper into that. Stay with us. Welcome back to Women Winning Divorce with Heather Quick, Owner and Attorney of Florida Women's Law Group. Heather, we've talked about all these mental disorders, the mental illnesses that are most associated with divorce. Let's dig a little bit deeper and talk about how mental illness affects marriage. It's more than difficult. It seems like there has to be another word that is greater than difficult because every day can be different.
Heather Quick:
I absolutely agree with you and I'm sure another word will come to us as we're discussing it, because I do think that's not even strong enough a word. I mean, it has to be just a constant struggle in battle with that. But we were talking earlier a little bit on both sides, but the person who is afflicted and has the mental illness, they can just have so many challenges. They might not be able to engage with their spouse or their children. A lack of motivation for sure and that can be... Instead of just saying depression, but if there's severe anxiety that can really keep people from doing things, right? They might not be motivated to go out and do things in the world because the anxiety has gotten so bad. That's something I think that I would venture to say, I do believe this to be true, that we've just seen a huge increase of that since COVID because of the forced isolation.
As people have a reentry, particularly the younger children who that isolation affected when they're still developing so much. But still, even with adults, the anxiety, the more you seclude yourself, the harder it becomes. Then you have a lack of motivation. Let's talk about substance abuse because many times that is the way you self-treat, and then it leads to other problems. But you're trying to self soothe, self-medicate through alcohol and medication. That has a huge effect on everybody involved.
Julie Morgan:
Oh wow. And I think about, as you just mentioned, how this could lead to so many other things. Substance abuse could possibly lead to domestic violence and oh, there are so many places that could go. So treating this where it begins is really the best idea.
Heather Quick:
Agree. Agreed. It can get so extreme that they can't work, they're unable to really address those issues. Think about the behavioral things that if you're angry, or irritable, or on the other side, impulsive. I mean, just think of how much all of these things come into play.
Julie Morgan:
Yes. Again, you have multiple people in the marriage that you are not expecting to be there and that is definitely not something that works. No. Another one on the list is hypersexual or decreased libido. That affects a marriage as well.
Heather Quick:
Absolutely. Certainly you can see how that would affect a marriage and in many times, either one. I think more the decreased libido is definitely associated with a lot of mental health medications, and that would be a reason that they stopped taking them.
Julie Morgan:
Yes. And it could also be a reason why the spouse may say, "Oh, don't take that today."
Heather Quick:
Yeah. Just so many things. There are really serious side effects to a lot of psychological medications that really do affect their day-to-day life. Then they're trying to balance, and you can't just take it one day and not the next, right? These things have to build up in your system and they have to be maintained. So that's just so much of a roller coaster.
Julie Morgan:
That makes me think that if you've decided, well, I mean... Well, we're talking about divorce, but I also think about the other side. If this is something you've decided that, hey, I'm going to stick with, you can't do that to a person and say, "Hey, don't take it today," because you don't know how that's going to affect them. You know?
Heather Quick:
Exactly. That is not a spouse who is supportive because they're not seeing the full picture, or appreciating what is necessary to maintain their mental stability.
Julie Morgan:
Yeah, exactly. Exactly. It's showing a lack of support. Yeah. Wow. Didn't really think about that. So earlier you mentioned about the person that has the mental illness, they could have a trouble engaging with their partner or even their kids. So this could affect their spouse because that means that they have so many other responsibilities that they could have been sharing.
Heather Quick:
Exactly. So I guess counter, not necessarily opposite to your saying, "there's more people in this relationship. Well, now you're on your own." Due to your spouse’s depression or difficulty engaging with you and the kids, you're basically functioning as a single parent. That leads obviously to resentment and feeling burnout because you're doing everything.
Julie Morgan:
Yeah. I wonder if the kids will then also try to pick up more responsibility, and then that takes away their childhood.
Heather Quick:
I think that absolutely happened in those kinds of cases just naturally. Depending on the age of the children they are, they're going to try to help or contribute where they can. That leads to other kinds of feelings, and yeah, really shortens their childhood and their having to deal with adult things. Also it will probably affect their social life because if things are stressful or weird at home, as kids think a lot of things are weird at home, especially when they're teenagers. Then maybe they're going to really curtail their social life based on what's going on at home.
Julie Morgan:
Yes. And think about also how it will affect them in school as well. They may not get as good of grades as they could get if they didn't have the responsibilities that they had at home.
Heather Quick:
Yes, indeed. Really that's when you see the codependent relationships created out of this, and people compensating and trying to figure that out, and that can happen with the kids too. They can be very codependent as well.
Julie Morgan:
And another thing I thought about, what if they're dealing with parents, or one parent, or possibly both that have a mental illness, and then they start to become depressed. And so now you have a family that has this mental illness. Wow. I didn't think about that.
Heather Quick:
Yeah. It's just so much.
Julie Morgan:
What about, let's say if one spouse has a mental illness, do you think that they'll start to avoid the other spouse just so, "I can't deal with this today," that type of thing?
Heather Quick:
I think so. I think that it takes a lot of energy. Some days you just may not have that energy, that ability and so you're going to pull back, and you're going to probably just want to focus on what you need to have done. But you might not have the energy to be that supportive spouse that maybe they need at that time. And that's fair. You can only do so much as a human being. That's one of the things that's so sad and problematic, with mental illness they still have to take some control for their treatment. They have to do something to get help. When they don't, that is going to be destructive to the marriage based on all these things we've talked about. That's hard as their spouse to be, you make excuses, and well, they can't do it, but really they can, they just won't.
Julie Morgan:
And that's where that codependency comes in, right?
Heather Quick:
Because you are trying to rescue them, trying to help them, but you're not equipped to do that. That is something that they're going to have to do, you can facilitate it, but if they don't go see a doctor, if they're not going to take the medicine that is prescribed, or go to the counseling that is necessary, nothing's going to change.
Julie Morgan:
Codependency and also a level of guilt.
Heather Quick:
I'm sure that guilt, the resentment, and the anger, all that just has to depending on the day. And then there'll be days where, hey, oh I remember he is acting like he used to, or this is better. So you get sucked in. It's just another cycle that has you on an emotional rollercoaster that in and of itself is going to be exhausting, because you don't know who's showing up today. You aren't prepared for how you're going to react that day. All that emotion has to be exhausting.
Julie Morgan:
Yeah. And another thing I thought about is the fact that guilt, you feel like, "Okay. I can't help them," but also you may say, "I just don't want to be here." And so you start to feel guilty that you don't want to be there.
Heather Quick:
Yeah. That you don't want to help anymore because you've tried. I know that my personality is I'll help you as long as you're in it with me helping you. But if you're giving up on helping yourself, I may want to being controlling person and a problem solver, may want to keep trying to fix it, but there would come a point where it's like, "This isn't something I can do." You have to do it yourself. So you have to just say, "I can't do it anymore."
Julie Morgan:
And I like the way you said that the person who has the mental illness, they also have to take some level of responsibility for their treatment.
Heather Quick:
Yes. Now let's be clear, there are some levels that really it's just very difficult. It's very difficult for them to maintain with or without medication. They may not even have that cognitive ability to break free from the mental illness to make those rational decisions. That's going to be heartbreaking for the people that love them, but also could be very destructive to you as the one watching this go by.
Julie Morgan:
So let's say, but I think about that and if they can take responsibility, some level of responsibility, if they do have some level of awareness of what's happening. It seems like it would be good for, it's not really recovery, because they'll still have the mental illness. But it'll be good for the help that they're getting if they take responsibility for what they have. Does that make sense?
Heather Quick:
Yeah, if they're able. I mean, because I just don't want to even pretend to say, "I know enough," to say that, but that's really hard even if they can't.
Julie Morgan:
Yeah. We talked about this as well, the ways it affects the other spouse, a lack of intimacy as far as the medication is concerned and how the mental health sufferer may have a low libido or medication that they take for treatment for this. And that could really make the other spouse feel alone if they're going through this.
Heather Quick:
Yeah. It can be very difficult, or is definitely a huge reason that marriages can't make it. I mean, that's a big part of marriage is having that intimacy in a way that you are close and trusting, and have that relationship more than just sex. It's more than just that. But they just might not even have that ability to be vulnerable and close. That's going to certainly affect that part of the marriage, because we as humans need that connection.
Julie Morgan:
One thing I was thinking about, you said to intimacy is, of course it's more than sex, but there are some illnesses where a person doesn't even want to be touched.
Heather Quick:
Indeed.
Julie Morgan:
And so that right there, if that's an illness, a mental illness that someone is dealing with, then that takes it to a whole nother level.
Heather Quick:
Yes.
Julie Morgan:
Would you say that this is one reason why, well, I already know the answer. It's getting help early when you see the signs. I mean, we've talked about a whole bunch of reasons. Getting help early is so important.
Heather Quick:
It is. I think sometimes, well, not sometimes, I would bet if you're going to see these changes in your spouse first. I would say that's when, instead of just brushing it under the rug, is bringing it up and being, if a supportive spouse in order to get treatment. Like I said, there is so much out there and available. It's not just you have to go to a psychiatrist and be prescribed medication. That is an option. But there are a lot of natural paths, and different doctors, and different types of things that truly I have heard. You just hear it all the time, it can really make a difference. So yeah, it's just getting that help to somebody, getting them a resource to begin to understand options. Because once somebody gets so far gone it's going to become harder, I think.
Julie Morgan:
Yes. You're listening to Women Winning Divorce with Heather Quick, Owner and Attorney of Florida Women's Law Group. We're going to take a quick break here, and when we return we're going to talk about divorcing a spouse with mental health issues. Stay with us. Welcome back to Women Winning Divorce with Heather Quick, Owner and Attorney of Florida Women's Law Group. Heather, let's now talk about divorcing a spouse with mental health issues. This is not uncommon.
Heather Quick:
No, not uncommon at all. Because we talked about in the beginning of the show, if we look at how many Americans are suffering from some sort of mental illness, and then however many of them are married. We know the divorce rate is 50%, I bet it comes into play more often than we even know.
Julie Morgan:
Ah, that's interesting. Do you think it's possible that they just don't, like in the divorce, they don't really reveal that the person has a mental illness because they may feel embarrassed themselves?
Heather Quick:
I think that is very possible. Many women, we talked about postpartum depression and actually, I'm going to say men and women, we all have hormones and they really, really affect us. Women as we know, we're just conditioned, and we go to the doctor a lot because we have to. When you're having kids and everything, I mean, we do more so I think routinely than most men. As men get older, their hormones and cortisol levels affect them significantly as well. It can really impact the way that people are behaving. It may appear as though somebody is really depressed, and they may be, but there may be many contributing factors.
All of a sudden you just come to a divorce and you're like, "They're just not the same person." I mean, let's use a typical example. They turn 50, midlife crisis, get a convertible, and they're gone. Or they retire and now they won't leave the house, and they don't want to do any hobbies. Then you're like, "Are they depressed?" I don't know. Or is this the person they've always been, they've just been at work all the time, but now it's so different. I don't know that I want to stay married to this person. And may not know that it's mental illness, and it may not be, who knows. But you just say, "They're not the same person." I'm sure they ask and try to go get help, but if they won't, things don't change. I think that many men and women just are like, "Well, I'm done."
Julie Morgan:
So they may not even realize it. They may not even know. They may not have even realized that that was the person they were living with because they may have been living two separate lives. When you mentioned as far as the midlife crisis, they were already living separate as far as how often they would see each other. It wasn't as often before retirement. So they didn't even realize what was happening.
Heather Quick:
Right. This is so easy to see. It happens all the time, just parallel lives and they're not really engaging that much, but they're kept busy with their separate jobs, with the kids, the activities. By the end of the day, maybe not as much time to talk or time goes on, and all of a sudden the kids leave. Okay. They go to college, and then one of them may just really have a hard time with that major milestone in life. It may lead to some depression, it may lead to all kind of things that they don't really understand except their spouse is like, "you don't ever want to do anything and you don't talk to me. You're not who you used to be and you won't seem to snap out of it."
Julie Morgan:
I like the way you said parallel lives and not separate lives, but parallel lives because you're still in the house together. You're still together and no talk of divorce up to a certain point, but parallel lives. Yeah.
Heather Quick:
Yeah. They're just in their own lane and there's not that intersection. Then the changes I think are physiological changes throughout life, major life events that happen. Your parents die, your children go to college, things that we naturally expect. Not even things that could be catastrophic, just part of life that then all of a sudden maybe obviously you hadn't experience, so you don't really cope as well. Maybe you do then become more anxious, or things start to happen, and you just appear to be a different person to your spouse. Your spouse, like we talked about in the earlier ones, could have really been work through that and support you for a long time.
At the end of the day, decide that nothing's changing, so I'm leaving. This is too exhausting and draining, and not really a marriage. This isn't something that has to be proven because Florida's in no fault state. So I think a lot of times those could be underlying things going on, but too much has happened. Again, maybe the spouse, "You're going to have to work on yourself. I can't do it for you."
Julie Morgan:
You went right in the direction that I was going in. I was wondering if this was something that you had to prove, because it seems like if the person doesn't want to go to the doctor, it would be difficult to prove.
Heather Quick:
Right. Really we had a huge list of mental illnesses, and there are some that really have some sides that can be extremely dangerous, not only to the person who has that mental illness but children, or they may have reckless behavior. So there might be a particular diagnosis let's say that you're going to need to bring it up. Let's say if you have children, you're like, my husband has PTSD, and if he hears a siren, he may go off and get guns and the kids will be in danger. That's a situation I'm just totally making up from watching a lot of TV over the years. But you can see how that would be something that's like, yeah, you're going to have to bring that and make that an issue, because there's the concern for the safety of the children.
Julie Morgan:
Ah, okay. All right. So there are times or reasons that you would bring up a mental health issue?
Heather Quick:
Indeed, and I think that being the primary one. Okay. Well, obviously if you have felt in danger, then you need to bring that up in the divorce and through the injunction process regarding domestic violence, if there's real safety issues for you and your children, either one. But then, because we've talked at many times about parenting plans and things of that nature. If you're concerned that, and this is a reason many women don't leave because they are worried, well then if they are going to get to be with the children by themselves, I'm worried about the children's safety. So then that becomes an issue that we absolutely have to prove and bring to the court's attention to hopefully create a solution, an option if there is one, when they have time with the children.
Julie Morgan:
Okay. So child custody, that's one reason you would bring it up. But alimony, why would that be a reason?
Heather Quick:
Well, geez, if they can't work, then they may want alimony from you.
Julie Morgan:
Oh, okay.
Heather Quick:
Yeah. That one's going to be a tough one to swallow all the way around. But there may be issues that their issues have kept you from working and you've had to take care of the kids. So maybe that's one of the factors. There are a lot of reasons that the mental health issue could come up and it just is going to depend on your particular situation. And how is that going to affect you, him, and the kids.
Julie Morgan:
Okay. Okay. So Heather, let me ask you this. All right. So when you said alimony, I mentioned alimony, I have an issue with alimony. So what if someone is faking? I mean, have you ever, well, I shouldn't ask you if you ever run across something like this. But what if someone is faking something like this, and then they want alimony? That bothers me.
Heather Quick:
Okay. I don't want to make jokes, because it's serious topic.
Julie Morgan:
Yeah. But it happens.
Heather Quick:
That was a woman wants alimony. You know me how I feel about that. However, I mean, it's not like this is the movies where people fake stuff like that. So that's all I could say. I don't know.
Julie Morgan:
Okay.
Heather Quick:
I think that is a normal thought and I'm certain it's happened, but I think that would be a tough one.
Julie Morgan:
Yeah. So basically, "Julie, you've been watching too many movies. Okay. It's all right. All right. I got it."
Heather Quick:
Yeah. Like, fake in your death and disappearance. What was that movie? "No, Julie. That doesn't happen every day."
Julie Morgan:
Wait a minute. Hold on. Hold on. Wait a minute. I know that movie. Okay. I'm going to think about it because you know what, part of it they were in New Orleans, they were in Louisiana, my home state. So I'm going to think about that one. Anyway, okay, let's move on. Alrighty. So I noticed that it says that you should really document everything, and this has come up over and over in our shows. Be sure to document everything.
Heather Quick:
I mean, to the extent, what I would like to emphasize on that, because this is where I think that there would be opportunities to make a record, and too often people don't. That's when there are areas, especially issues with safety and your spouse really going over the edge, let's say with paranoia or with PTSD. I would recommend safety, if there are issues that do come up, I know you just sometimes want to leave, but that you do notify law enforcement. Because those things are so serious, and we have all read about things in the paper where the whole family dies tragically. If the time when you were scared, you would've called, maybe there would've been more of a record and that wouldn't happen. I've heard many times, "Well, I think that will make him go over the edge." And it's like, "Well, I think if that's going to happen, it's going to happen."
When people have serious mental illness issues and you have safety concerns, you really have to do the smart thing, get out, call the police. You have to bring in people who are actually trained and equipped to deal with that. That's going to give you evidence, but to keep you safe and your kids in the future. It's not to say that if there are serious issues, they're not going to come out and we're not going to be able to prove that. It's just, there are really much better ways in taking that stuff seriously along the way. There's also, there are some civil remedies within the court system where we've certainly helped women who they're like, I don't really want to divorce, but I want to force them to get some help. There is an avenue with which to do that in our court system. We have successfully helped people to do that, at least as a first step. That's a great thing to do to really help someone you love, but you do have to have some court intervention for that.
Julie Morgan:
Okay. I didn't know that. So they can ask the court to help them before they even get to this point of divorce, is that right?
Heather Quick:
Yeah. That's called a Marchman Act, and there's a lot of options there for, earlier in this case when you know they're having issues, and we've talked about before, you just want them to get help. Is it drastic? Okay. Well, maybe, but if they're not going voluntarily, it may help. So that is something that just, as you know, it's a huge thing just to throw in there. But there are options for women who are dealing with this and don't know what to do. Sometimes there are things we can do to help you along that way. I mean, most of the time, obviously in our office, it's like, "Okay. Well, we have to file for divorce," and that's really what we can do. Every now and then there are some other things that can be done when appropriate. They're so very fact specific, but they at least give you something, a way to potentially help your spouse.
Julie Morgan:
Okay. Well, Heather, we've come to the end of the show. Is there anything else you'd like to add?
Heather Quick:
Well, as always, Julie, for any woman listening to this, experiencing this or know somebody who has these issues, we are here to help at Florida Women's Law Group. And just reach out to us and schedule a consultation so that we can get you moving forward.
Julie Morgan:
Well, Heather, it's always a pleasure.
Heather Quick:
Same here, Julie. I appreciate it.
Julie Morgan:
I'll see you next time.
Heather Quick:
Yes, indeed.
Julie Morgan:
Thank you for listening to Women Winning Divorce. We hope you found information to help you navigate your divorce. If you like our show, please take the time to subscribe and provide a five star review. If you need more information, please visit our website at womenwinningdivorce.com, where you will find previous episodes and other helpful content. Join us next week as we continue our journey of women winning divorce.